Translation

Tobias_Brox · May 24, 2000, 4:21pm

Tobias,

Please take this to rt-devel, not to me personally. Jesse is even more
interessted than me to get the localizations out. I hope you don’t mind
that I quote this to the devel list.

I started reading the documentation for the
package gettext which can help automating
this task. It generates a pot file which
facilitates considerably the internationalization
of software.

There is a lot of problems with gettext; it looks great until someone
actually tries to use it. One will bang the head towards the
wall quite quickly because of grammatical problems, etc. Jesse has some
other links to another perl package for dealing with this in an object
oriented matter, I haven’t looked too much at it, but it looks very nice I
think.

I think it would be great if you could coordinate the localization work.
Jesse and me is just too busy getting a usable 2.0.

This work needs to be done towards the development version of RT, not
version 1.0 which is the last official release. The current development
versions seems to work, but there is a lot of pieces missing before it can
be widely used.

Tobias_Brox · May 24, 2000, 4:48pm

I think it would be great if you could coordinate the localization work.
Jesse and me is just too busy getting a usable 2.0.

Very short about RT2:

we have a web UI in HTML::Mason, there is some perl code and quite some
web design, and some mason magic joined together.
we have some few strings that are generated in the source/libraries
we have a command line interface where everything is done in the source
we have a mail interface, where some things is done in the source and
some things through Text::Template templates.
we have some templates (for mail handling, etc) in Text::Template

Blue_Lang · May 24, 2000, 5:48pm

did anyone manage to tag and roll a tarball of the current 1.3 build last
night?

(for those of you following the ‘get blue on CVS’ saga, the firewall tests
all went thru last night, and i should have cvs access tommorrow… woo!)

thanks,

    Blue Lang                              Unix Systems Admin
    QSP, Inc., 3200 Atlantic Ave, Ste 100, Raleigh, NC, 27604
    Home: 919 835 1540  Work: 919 875 6994  Fax: 919 872 4015

Jesse1 · May 24, 2000, 8:19pm

that’d be 1.3.7. and it’s up now. not that it’s ready for productionOn Wed, May 24, 2000 at 01:48:47PM -0400, Blue Lang wrote:

did anyone manage to tag and roll a tarball of the current 1.3 build last
night?

(for those of you following the ‘get blue on CVS’ saga, the firewall tests
all went thru last night, and i should have cvs access tommorrow… woo!)

thanks,

–
Blue Lang Unix Systems Admin
QSP, Inc., 3200 Atlantic Ave, Ste 100, Raleigh, NC, 27604
Home: 919 835 1540 Work: 919 875 6994 Fax: 919 872 4015

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Rubens_Queiroz_de_Al · June 8, 2000, 8:39pm

Hi all,

I would like to volunteer to work on the internationalization
of rt. I am not a developer, but I can study and learn how
to do things provided I get some guidance (not much, I promise).

Thank you all,

Rubens
Rubens Queiroz de Almeida
Divisï¿½o de Serviï¿½os a Comunidade UNICAMP - CENTRO DE COMPUTAï¿½ï¿½O
Fone: 0 xx 19 788 2235 FAX: 0 xx 19 289 2577
email: queiroz@unicamp.br

Tobias_Brox · June 9, 2000, 8:11am

I would like to volunteer to work on the internationalization
of rt.

Localization, I guess. If I’ve understood the terminology right, i18n
(internationalization) is just to get it working and getting stuff like
dates, etc, correct. I think RT2 fits the bill already; the templates
(for mail correspondance) can be set up in whatever language and charset
that is wanted. Currently the dates are printed according to the
international ISO standard; though it would have been better to follow the
Locale setting. l10n (localization) is to translate everything, so people
with no clue about english can use the product.

Mainly, those components needs translation;

the default mail templates (though that is not so important, because the
local RT admin should be able to replace those easily him/herself). I’ve
already set up the database setting so that different translations of
every mail template can exist. Next, we need to be able to store
“preffered language” for every RT user and requestor. That’s a good idea,
I’ll modify the schema.mysql right away.
the HTML::Mason modules/templates for the web interface. One way to do
that is to make a module for translation, and every time some piece of
text is to be inserted, we call this module, i.e. <& t, text=>“This is
some text” &>. I don’t like that too much, but it seems to be the best
option with Mason anyway. You might eventually lurk a bit at the Mason
mailinglist and ask if anybody there have any experience with l10n.
Error messages from the code itself - as well as all the text
that is currently hardcoded into the mail interface and the cli.
Configuration; I guess we in the long term want to move anything that
doesn’t need to be in config.pm to the database. In the short term I
think it’s safe to assume that the person installing and setting up RT
can handle English.

I did write another long mail earlier about l10n, I’ll see if I can find
it.

Also, Jesse once posted an URL to a very interessting article about
Locale::Maketext. I guess we’re going to use that package. It’s a
descendant of GNU gettext, I think - just that it’s better at handling
languages with different grammar than English.

I am not a developer,

That’s bad.

but I can study and learn how
to do things provided I get some guidance (not much, I promise).

That is nice. I guess the best thing for doing that is to meet us in
Plzen the 19th of June. In addition you should try to install RT2 and
ask for help every time you’re stuck with it.

Memo to the rtcon: Do not forget to discuss l10n

For anyone that missed the rtcon invitation, it’s located at
http://www.fsck.com/~tobiasb/rtcon.html

Rubens_Queiroz_de_Al · May 24, 2000, 3:08pm

Hi,

I have been experimenting with RT and I am interested in
translating it into Portuguese. Does anybody have an idea
about the best way of doing that?

Best regards,

Rubens
Rubens Queiroz de Almeida
Divisï¿½o de Serviï¿½os a Comunidade UNICAMP - CENTRO DE COMPUTAï¿½ï¿½O
Fone: 0 xx 19 788 2235 FAX: 0 xx 19 289 2577
email: queiroz@unicamp.br

Tobias_Brox · May 24, 2000, 3:43pm

I have been experimenting with RT and I am interested in
translating it into Portuguese. Does anybody have an idea
about the best way of doing that?

How urgent is it?

We will look into the localization complexity of RT2, and RT2 will be
localized into several languages, but not in the very near future, I’m
afraid.

For RT1, all content is in the code, that’s downright ugly, but it should
be possible to go in there and translate things. I’d really recommend
waiting for a cleaner solution, though.

Jesse1 · May 24, 2000, 3:53pm

Someone who has the time and the interest really needs to look
into what we need to do in order to build a translation framework for RT2.
Tobias and I have poked at a few things and are trying to desing RT2
to not make translation impossible. But the sooner someone starts
on building the translation framework, the better.

JesseOn Wed, May 24, 2000 at 12:08:45PM -0300, Rubens Queiroz de Almeida wrote:

Hi,

I have been experimenting with RT and I am interested in
translating it into Portuguese. Does anybody have an idea
about the best way of doing that?

Best regards,

Rubens

Rubens Queiroz de Almeida
Divisão de Serviços a Comunidade UNICAMP - CENTRO DE COMPUTAÇÃO
Fone: 0 xx 19 788 2235 FAX: 0 xx 19 289 2577
email: queiroz@unicamp.br

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“Bother,” said Pooh, “Eeyore, ready two photon torpedoes and lock
phasers on the Heffalump, Piglet, meet me in transporter room three”

Anil_Madhavapeddy · May 24, 2000, 4:03pm

Jesse wrote:

Someone who has the time and the interest really needs to look
into what we need to do in order to build a translation framework for RT2.
Tobias and I have poked at a few things and are trying to desing RT2
to not make translation impossible. But the sooner someone starts
on building the translation framework, the better.

I’d say GNU gettext is your friend for this:

Have a look at the perl bindings for it on CPAN:
http://search.cpan.org/doc/PVANDRY/gettext-1.01/README

All it really involves is wrapping all of your text calls
with a gettext(),

so instead of

print “Please enter your username and password\n”;

you would have

print gettext(“Please enter your username and password”).“\n”;

More details in that URL.

Anil Madhavapeddy, anil@recoil.org

Jesse1 · May 24, 2000, 4:13pm

Well, actually, there was an article in TPJ about localisation
explaining all the reasons the at gettext is broken. The author proposed
and implemented a cool new system called Locale::Maketext that appears
a good deal more flexible.

jesseOn Wed, May 24, 2000 at 05:03:05PM +0100, Anil Madhavapeddy wrote:

Jesse wrote:

Someone who has the time and the interest really needs to look
into what we need to do in order to build a translation framework for RT2.
Tobias and I have poked at a few things and are trying to desing RT2
to not make translation impossible. But the sooner someone starts
on building the translation framework, the better.

I’d say GNU gettext is your friend for this:

Have a look at the perl bindings for it on CPAN:
http://search.cpan.org/doc/PVANDRY/gettext-1.01/README

All it really involves is wrapping all of your text calls
with a gettext(),

so instead of

print “Please enter your username and password\n”;

you would have

print gettext(“Please enter your username and password”).“\n”;

More details in that URL.

–
Anil Madhavapeddy, anil@recoil.org

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Tobias_Brox · May 24, 2000, 4:15pm

Tobias and I have poked at a few things and are trying to desing RT2
to not make translation impossible.

Ah, that’s exactly the words I was searching for

Tobias_Brox · May 24, 2000, 4:27pm

I’d say GNU gettext is your friend for this:

No. The intention is good, but it quite often fails to perform good due
to totally different grammars.

Let’s take the directory listing problem:

0 files shown
1 file shown
2 files shown
3 files shown
20 files shown

with GNU gettext it would apperently make sense to write this as
something like:

“%d file%s shown”

…until you discover that it all of the lines above are totally different
in some of the language you want to translate to.

There is another, better, package out there. Jesse has posted an URL
earlier, maybe it was only to me and not to the devel-list.